Ideas to help promote dueling in DoM.

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Hope
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Post by Hope »

I think people should go above and beyond what is expected of them to make it an inviting and fun environment. To add a little flair to holiday dueling, I made icons for Christmas-eve DoF when the night came around. Little things will help people have a fun time. It just takes a few minutes to think it up, an IM or two to the right person with the right photoshop and then implementing it IC.
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Post by PrlUnicorn »

Saieniel wrote: Firstly, anyone who takes anything Jesse does IC seriously ... well, there are greater issues with that, aren't there?
Yes, I know and I'm tired of having to explain that the character is nuttier than a squirrel's horde to players that are new to the dueling venues and RP. People walk away because they have enough to deal with in real life, the thing they use RP to escape for a while.
Saieniel wrote: As for being thick skinned? We're adults here, not children. If a player's maturity level makes them incapable of distinguishing the difference between IC and OOC and takes IC too personally, that is ultimately on that player and needs to be dealt with by them personally. They shouldn't have to be handled with kid gloves by others. I'm not saying people should be jerks, but there needs to be recognition that it can't always be sunshine and daisies IC.
Never make the assumption that all players are adults. I made that mistake a while back and learned that several brilliant writers were teenagers between 13-17 years of age.

I said this elsewhere, but I'm going say it again. Some players have chosen to avoid playing in any given venue because, whatever has gone on in their day, they just don't want to deal with whatever Character(s) X, Y, and/or Z might be doing that day. Some of us call that saving our sanity and/or avoiding having someone else's fun ruined. You can call that blending if you want, but the person that plays and really shouldn't be there is more likely to blend their crappy mood into their character's general attitude.

No, RP isn't all sunshine and rainbows nor should it be. But there are limits. The point that's been missed is simple. Before you ask for help and ideas to draw people in, you have to consider why they come and don't return or why they limit their play. It's a bigger picture than what can we do to bring more people in. Fix what some people see as broken then move forward to new things.

----------------------------------

Moving onward.

Can anyone sponsor a DoM special event/tournament or does it have to be an official?
ETA: Lem already covered that. Thanks!
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PrlUnicorn
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Post by PrlUnicorn »

Kalamere wrote:I wasn't so much saying that Tuesday should move to RoH, I guess more just throwing it out there that the only night DoM gets is over on RDI and that it's a pretty sucky night in general for RP. I know there used to be a Monday shift, but frankly, Monday is probably worse than Tuesday.

I've no idea if it would help matters, but some kind of presense (even just a short shift) on RoH and on a more popular playing night might help. Of course, I imagine that's a fight to be had with the other coordinators.
Part of the problem is DoM is always sharing a night. But what sport's group would be willing to have the day taken away to give it a spotlight of its own? I seem to remember the Fight Night had its beginnings after a discussion suggesting that DoM needed more exposure.
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Post by Jake »

PrlUnicorn wrote:
Kalamere wrote:I wasn't so much saying that Tuesday should move to RoH, I guess more just throwing it out there that the only night DoM gets is over on RDI and that it's a pretty sucky night in general for RP. I know there used to be a Monday shift, but frankly, Monday is probably worse than Tuesday.

I've no idea if it would help matters, but some kind of presense (even just a short shift) on RoH and on a more popular playing night might help. Of course, I imagine that's a fight to be had with the other coordinators.
Part of the problem is DoM is always sharing a night. But what sport's group would be willing to have the day taken away to give it a spotlight of its own? I seem to remember the Fight Night had its beginnings after a discussion suggesting that DoM needed more exposure.
Generally, it's not that simple. Each sport having it's own dedicated night isn't necessarily going to make anything better.

There *are* better nights for most people to duel. Generally, those align with the weekends + Thursday (which for some reason was a good night for many to duel).

I think that's one of the advantages of Fight Night. Then there's no competition for night. It's just whatever people want to duel.

IFL did a *lot* to up the exposure of DoF, which I presume is why DoS numbers dropped off during IFL (and DoF went up). My memory is that we see similar spikes in DoS around Madness time.

I do think a DoM-format event/tourney/league of some kind is well worth a shot in the near future.
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Post by PrlUnicorn »

Jake wrote:
IFL did a *lot* to up the exposure of DoF, which I presume is why DoS numbers dropped off during IFL (and DoF went up). My memory is that we see similar spikes in DoS around Madness time.

I do think a DoM-format event/tourney/league of some kind is well worth a shot in the near future.
Your memory agrees with mine. There are spikes in DoS around Madness and all sports for Hydra. A DoM league/tourney/etc. could cover one of the open sections of the calendar. The time limit is important because people lose interest/steam and/or can only set aside so much time from their personal responsibilities to participate. Entire cycles are too long for any given specialty thing. Six weeks seems to be the optimum.

Jaycy ran the Intergender War a few times. Maybe that's something that could be looked at for DoM?
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Post by Napoleon Bonarat »

I'm the odd one out and I know it's because I'm biased, but I'd be happier if all duels took place on ROH with the exceptions of events like DOF going to SEB.

I get why it happens and don't disagree with whatever the numbers say. I just like coming to one place to get my duel on. :)
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Post by Spell »

How about this...

Monday = DoM on ROH, DoF on RDI.
Tuesday = DoM on RDI, DoF on ROH.

Lem brought up how Monday back in 2007 was dead, but I think that the community could be active enough to try a Monday DoM shift.

The main problem is callers though. If there would be enough to fill this shift. One or two. I wouldn't mind offering to help call a late shift.

All and all I guess the topic of trying to keep it community driven and not bother the coords much was useless! :)
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Post by Vanion Shadowcast »

I wouldn't say trying to encourage things that are community driven was useless. There have been some good community ideas:

- A team sport focused on DoM.
- Keeper Tournaments. (I'm in.)
- Creating a more welcoming environment.
- Everyone being more actively willing to duel.

Working together with the coordinators is a valuable effort for us to be making, too.

Re: Additional Shifts.

I would be interested to see what would happen if DoM got a Saturday Night shift to share alongside DoS' Saturday shift. I know that for me, and for a number of folks on my dueling team, Mondays/Tuesdays are often-times the worst nights for us to duel, no matter the venue.

It's also worth noting that DoF and DoS each have two nights a week where they are the only game available on RoH. DoM does not have such a night.

DoS (four nights per week, two solo nights per week)
DoF (five nights per week, two solo nights per week)
DoM (three nights per week, no solo nights per week)

What if Tuesdays became solely DoM nights? Would that encourage the DoF players on Tuesdays to play DoM instead?
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Post by Spell »

Vanion Shadowcast wrote:I wouldn't say trying to encourage things that are community driven was useless.
I meant in a way that wouldn't need much coord involvement that adds more to their shoulders, such as changing shift-times or rules, which some parts of the thread turned into. I meant trying to keep it player-based was useless, but not in a bad way.

Also DoM on Saturday might not be for the best. Many tournaments and Player events happen on Saturday. That and it's usually the slowest day dueling wise.

As for DoF on Monday. DoF Monday has been one of those nights that garnered a good bunch of RP / Dueling in the past couple of months.

While opening more nights for DoM could be good. There also should be a way to draw in players to duel there. DoM has one night already where it's alone and it's not gaining much in numbers, that along with double fight nights. Lem bringing up how Monday would go dueless at times in 2007 also shows that more days does not exactly mean players will use it.

More days is nice but it might not really be a big fix. It'd be kind of sad seeing a new day added for DoM, two new callers put into a position, and then little to no duels take place. Most likely doing a few Monday test runs couldn't hurt, along with doing a few DoM Tuesday test runs over on RoH side.

As for a solo night for DoM. Yes, it could have benefits. But it seems some of the players who show up to DoF Tuesday and not DoM want nothing to do with the sport. Be it either personal reasons or that their characters simply don't fit in with a magic setting. DoF Tuesday gives players an option to opt out and fight fists instead. It hasn't really hurt DoMs numbers by being open. That and both of them being on separate sites makes it easier to have both RoH and RDI open to duel two sports at once; and that's what usually happens.
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Post by Vanion Shadowcast »

Well, I gave a list of ideas earlier in this thread, but I'll repeat the one that seems like the biggest no-brainer to me (besides the creation of a DoM Team League of some sort):

Make Archmage a challenge-able rank for Mages, and give those Mages an SOA-like pre-requisite to encourage upper-level activity. Ultimately, upper-level activity is what draws in roleplay most effectively and encourages newer players by the way of providing positive examples. Sure, the AMT would become more like a Warlord Tournament, but the overall benefits would be significant.
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Post by Spell »

Vanion Shadowcast wrote:Well, I gave a list of ideas earlier in this thread, but I'll repeat the one that seems like the biggest no-brainer to me (besides the creation of a DoM Team League of some sort):

Make Archmage a challenge-able rank for Mages, and give those Mages an SOA-like pre-requisite to encourage upper-level activity. Ultimately, upper-level activity is what draws in roleplay most effectively and encourages newer players by the way of providing positive examples. Sure, the AMT would become more like a Warlord Tournament, but the overall benefits would be significant.
It has merit. Yes, that would draw more activity from mages, but at the same time DoS is twice the cycle time of DoM and there's really not many SoA challenges except 2 or 3, which are even more rare. I've heard complaints of some disliking SoA because 10 duels can be seen as "hard" to do. This really would only benefit the more active players and players who are seeking titles, which is ultimately mages. There's much more interest in lower-rank DoM challenges it seems since the four Towers are more accessible.

The way it is now. Archmage is something that is strived for. You have to win in a tournament against your peers then challenge the Archmage. It's bragging rights. Also with the faster cycles, it means Archmages can be challenged twice compared to once by a WLT winner. It would be like making the Diamond challengeable. Also unlike the Overlord, which is if you go below 15 WoLs you can be challenged by your Loyal barons. In DoM if you go below 15 WoLs, mages can challenge you without any requirements beyond being of mage rank. It makes the two titles completely different.
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Post by Vanion Shadowcast »

I definitely think that the short cycle of DoM lends itself to the idea of allowing Archmage challenges. The higher frequency of AMTs vs Warlord Tournaments means that winning the right to challenge via tournament is easier in DoM than it is in DoS.

The SOA requirements in DoS hear complaints (not from me, granted) because SOA is one of the only ways to challenge for the lower titles (Baronies). DoM doesn't have that problem, because the Towers are very easy to challenge for, comparatively.

As a Mage player who only logs a couple of duels a cycle in regulation DoM, I'll tell you the two things that would make me more active:

- Allowing Archmage Challenges with a SOA requirement.
- Fixing the matrix.

Veteran players tend to attract their friends, draw in new players, and promote ongoing roleplay. Getting DoM's Mages to be more active via incentive is, IMO, the best demographic to target for a trickle down effect.
Last edited by Vanion Shadowcast on Tue Jan 28, 2014 4:16 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Spell »

Could always add a required activity duel to be allowed in the AMT. That would get mages to duel at least once a cycle.

What exactly in the DoM Matrix need to be fixed? DoM 4 made the game pretty balanced.
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Post by Vanion Shadowcast »

Spell wrote:Could always add a required activity duel to be allowed in the AMT. That would get mages to duel at least once a cycle.
While that's true, I don't think once a cycle is going to fix much in terms of making Mages more consistently active.
What exactly in the DoM Matrix need to be fixed? DoM 4 made the game pretty balanced.
This discussion would really be a whole other thread. It's a pretty common belief with a number of players that the DoM matrix is not balanced. In short, the addition of FF/FT years back, made to balance the game for low ranked players (to break up the Perfect Defense matrix, as we called it) ... in turn unbalanced the full, open matrix by skewing it. Now that the matrix is entirely open, FF/FT's impact is negative, overall. As I've said, making FF lose to Arctic Blast, FT lose to Meteor Storm, and FT null to Armor would balance things out from my perspective.
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Post by Spell »

Vanion Shadowcast wrote:
Spell wrote:Could always add a required activity duel to be allowed in the AMT. That would get mages to duel at least once a cycle.
While that's true, I don't think once a cycle is going to fix much in terms of making Mages more consistently active.
Lead by example. Show that anything title-related should be gained by active players.

The short cycle period of DoM in play. A 30 day grace for a defending Archmage if 10 SoA were brought into play. It'd mean only a few mages could even have a shot to gain the title. Not only that, but how would these mages find duels? I've seen mage-ranked players come to the duels and ask for DoM fights and get no where.
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